adding full newtonian physics wouldn't be possible on a script.
u can easily set the max speed of all ships really high so they seem to accelerate forever.
but having it cut off the engines and carry on at the same speed will work simlar to how the advanced thrusters work now, but it has its limits
[SCRIPT] Advanced Thruster Control V1.01 : Updated 08/05/2006
Moderators: Moderators for English X Forum, Scripting / Modding Moderators
-
nazaxprime
- Posts: 11
- Joined: Sat, 16. Dec 06, 07:32
Hoping for newtons sake.
Hi lady’s and gent's, you too Mr. Un-categorical . Being the new guy I, as of yet i don’t know the ins and outs of the X-engine. This is day one of the mod/script research (I’ve actually done pretty well for myself securing blender and locating this page as well as about 300 more...DOH)...I got a long way to go. By the game dynamics I’ve noticed I got a simple idea about the weapons fire. im sure it will get shot down because if it was this simple it would be functional. That is not the point though, it is the idea. If it isn’t simple in the engine then one might not even consider this. In engine weapons have velocity. If you could adjust the initial escape velocity to clear the ship model (proportional to the ships current vector/velocity) then you should be able to escape collision effects that cause the ship to interrupt the base script that you are running. I’m not absolutely sure that is the issue here (It is a fun dynamic to mod either way including force physics.) but if it is i hope i could be of at least a little help with all the "robbin'n and stealin" I’m gunna be doing around these parts in the months to come. Just a thought, my first 2 cents on the forums. Sadly i see that this tread seems inoperable, so wish me luck on my first post. please dont let the dream die, if it is continuing elsewhere please let me know where... i want this probably more than any script i could think of. I also know i have made no mention of the actual script but i have not seen it would not know what i wos looking at yet and from the sounds of it a seasoned vet arround here is all over it and facing severe complications...but i swear to whatever that ill help on this one.
The technecro-mancer in full swing
ok maybe its not that dead but a fresh corpse is easier to work with...lol the technecro-mancer in full swing ok maby its not that dead but a fresh corpse is easier to work with...lol
The technecro-mancer in full swing
ok maybe its not that dead but a fresh corpse is easier to work with...lol the technecro-mancer in full swing ok maby its not that dead but a fresh corpse is easier to work with...lolRe: Hoping for newtons sake.
the scripting engine is quite limited for doing this kinda thing.nazaxprime wrote:Hi lady’s and gent's, you too Mr. Un-categorical . Being the new guy I, as of yet i don’t know the ins and outs of the X-engine. This is day one of the mod/script research (I’ve actually done pretty well for myself securing blender and locating this page as well as about 300 more...DOH)...I got a long way to go. By the game dynamics I’ve noticed I got a simple idea about the weapons fire. im sure it will get shot down because if it was this simple it would be functional. That is not the point though, it is the idea. If it isn’t simple in the engine then one might not even consider this. In engine weapons have velocity. If you could adjust the initial escape velocity to clear the ship model (proportional to the ships current vector/velocity) then you should be able to escape collision effects that cause the ship to interrupt the base script that you are running. I’m not absolutely sure that is the issue here (It is a fun dynamic to mod either way including force physics.) but if it is i hope i could be of at least a little help with all the "robbin'n and stealin" I’m gunna be doing around these parts in the months to come. Just a thought, my first 2 cents on the forums. Sadly i see that this tread seems inoperable, so wish me luck on my first post. please dont let the dream die, if it is continuing elsewhere please let me know where... i want this probably more than any script i could think of. I also know i have made no mention of the actual script but i have not seen it would not know what i wos looking at yet and from the sounds of it a seasoned vet arround here is all over it and facing severe complications...but i swear to whatever that ill help on this one.
The technecro-mancer in full swing
infact there is no way to adjust any kind of physics on the ship, you cant set velocity for anything, or even change the speed of the ship.
how this script works, is to splot a straight line path in the direction your ship was traveling, then simply moving the ship down this line at set intervals.
however, the problem exists coz the move command checks for collections each time, and if it collides, it moves it to a random "safe" location. And theres no way to override this.
due to this, i added a fail safe to detect this random location and causes it to cut off the device. The problem is, the collections are effected by weapons fire, so the ship gets moves out of the way of the fire as well, causing it to cut off.
im trying to work on a way to limit the fail safe so weapons fire doesn't trigger it
-
Schabernack
- Posts: 216
- Joined: Wed, 18. Apr 07, 19:32
i like the idea of a 180° turn,
this is an real action element and i will test it soon
but isnt it a bit to mighty if you could do that with M6,M7,M1,M2,M0?
k, make it more expensive, let them use energy cells, but all after
the M7 would break in parts at such like manouver, isn't it?
i don't know if i get it all right my english is not all the best if it goes into physics ^^, k in german my physics is not good too
but from the effect there should be a minimum speed to make a turn,
It could be funny but not very realistic to turn at zero speed or so.
If you turn a ship, the engines would take you in the opposite direction,
in x3 space without engines we lose speed at least.
Combat situation:
one at my back is really close, i turn arround at speed 130,
lose speed but have about 10-20sec to bring serious dmg to him,
as mostly the same ship types or smaller ships are at my back,
this would be reasonable.
I drop down 100 and the ship turns me arround.
I take up speed and do it again if necessary.
OR
You are aiming a M2, strave, roll in and fire on sigth,
when you're shortly behind the foe you turn arround give
once again a kick in the back and could see if his PiC are toooo close,
switch again and out manouver his salvo.
My suggestion would be sth like
- minimum speed 110 to activate the thrusters
- turnback at speed <100
- losing speed as you have engines set to zero
- increasing prize to ship type
- M3-M7 needs additional energy cells or take energy shortly from the weapons/shields
-M2,M1,M0 cant do that at all
gl&hf
PS: mmm, this post was a bit long ^^ but i was encouraged by nazaxprime
this is an real action element and i will test it soon
but isnt it a bit to mighty if you could do that with M6,M7,M1,M2,M0?
k, make it more expensive, let them use energy cells, but all after
the M7 would break in parts at such like manouver, isn't it?
i don't know if i get it all right my english is not all the best if it goes into physics ^^, k in german my physics is not good too
but from the effect there should be a minimum speed to make a turn,
It could be funny but not very realistic to turn at zero speed or so.
If you turn a ship, the engines would take you in the opposite direction,
in x3 space without engines we lose speed at least.
Combat situation:
one at my back is really close, i turn arround at speed 130,
lose speed but have about 10-20sec to bring serious dmg to him,
as mostly the same ship types or smaller ships are at my back,
this would be reasonable.
I drop down 100 and the ship turns me arround.
I take up speed and do it again if necessary.
OR
You are aiming a M2, strave, roll in and fire on sigth,
when you're shortly behind the foe you turn arround give
once again a kick in the back and could see if his PiC are toooo close,
switch again and out manouver his salvo.
My suggestion would be sth like
- minimum speed 110 to activate the thrusters
- turnback at speed <100
- losing speed as you have engines set to zero
- increasing prize to ship type
- M3-M7 needs additional energy cells or take energy shortly from the weapons/shields
-M2,M1,M0 cant do that at all
gl&hf
PS: mmm, this post was a bit long ^^ but i was encouraged by nazaxprime
-
Harlock776
- Posts: 2261
- Joined: Wed, 9. Mar 05, 21:53
fringe
WOW!!! Cycrow you must have played that old game tachyon the fringe at some point in time because this same feature was in that game as well. I always used the slide maneuver to keep from getting hit by enemy fire or to attack large structures or ships. Just slide over the structure or ship and fire at it until your ship clears. I haven't played X3 yet but probably by the time I get around to doing that your script will be working really well:-)
Our mighty sovereign may she always go before us sailing brightly in the sea of black.
Some advancement in this script? I mean the "safe distance" problem, etc.
When perfectioned, this would be one of the most revolutionary script for combat dynamics and fun it can gives, so please don't give up if ther's a way to improve it All the most decent space combat games have a "cut engine" or "inertia compensation turn-off" command, even the most arcade Freelancer (that nevertherless could be made very very "newtonian" after some little modding 
) had one...
When perfectioned, this would be one of the most revolutionary script for combat dynamics and fun it can gives, so please don't give up if ther's a way to improve it
All the most decent space combat games have a "cut engine" or "inertia compensation turn-off" command, even the most arcade Freelancer (that nevertherless could be made very very "newtonian" after some little modding ) had one...Just 1 small thing, apart of the said issues you're getting into account:
When the ship returns to conventional engine, it changes its course istantanely. that's weird...
No way the script makes first the ship decelerate to 0 before returning to conventional engine ?:?
When the ship returns to conventional engine, it changes its course istantanely. that's weird...
No way the script makes first the ship decelerate to 0 before returning to conventional engine ?:?
Last edited by Realspace on Tue, 29. May 07, 17:03, edited 1 time in total.
![[ external image ]](http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m106/Xtended_Images/Xtended%20Sigs/Argon2.gif){kind=link}
Newtonian dynamics would just completely wreck gameplay, as cute as it otherwise would be. This happened in I-War, for example, where you could mop the floor with the AI, since it couldn't use appropriate tactics. And if it could, the player would be seriously frustrated. Physics just isn't the strong point of X, and it need not be.
To actually input something about the script - I was thinking maybe you could make a check for bullets before you move the ship? Then move all bullets away from the position the ship will end up in. This would lead to somewhat inaccurate fire, but would not interrupt the command. Just a thought.
To actually input something about the script - I was thinking maybe you could make a check for bullets before you move the ship? Then move all bullets away from the position the ship will end up in. This would lead to somewhat inaccurate fire, but would not interrupt the command. Just a thought.
Well, that's just your opinion since we don't know how the AI could be implemented. Probably it was bad in I-War but it is not the ony game that had some more newtonian physics. Just take a look at the freeware "Babylon 5 I've found her", there the same physics model of I-war is used (and with no speed limitation), very realistic acceleration/deceleration time, but easy to manouver ships (no rotational inertia or such) ... and of course "inertial compensation" switch ...ttl wrote:Newtonian dynamics would just completely wreck gameplay, as cute as it otherwise would be. This happened in I-War, for example, where you could mop the floor with the AI, since it couldn't use appropriate tactics. And if it could, the player would be seriously frustrated. Physics just isn't the strong point of X, and it need not be.
and it is alooooot of fun!!
I really never understand these paternalistic claims such as "the player would be frustrated, etc." ... ehy, man, we are not EGOSOFT here, we are people discussing a way to change a game into something we like more, we are players too. This is modding, not game development. If you don't want it, just ignore the plug-in, whenever it come out and whenever Cycrow would decid that this kind of extension could be added
@Realspace:
Sorry if I offended you, I certainly don't try to tell you how to play your game. All I'm saying is, profound modifications should take a bit more into account than "Oooh, that's sooo cool". The single most important and frequent omitted factor is the AI. A game like X3 is played against the AI, so with the AI crippled, there would be no fun. At least not for me.
As for the I-war part, that game was a ton of fun - until I learned just how much the dynamics can be (ab)used. If the AI would not have speed limits, and could use half-smart evasion routines, the player could practically never kill a ship. That's why I say it would be frustratring.
But this is not thread about I-war, nor is it about Newtonian dynamics. Apalogies again, if I was found offensive.
Sorry if I offended you, I certainly don't try to tell you how to play your game. All I'm saying is, profound modifications should take a bit more into account than "Oooh, that's sooo cool". The single most important and frequent omitted factor is the AI. A game like X3 is played against the AI, so with the AI crippled, there would be no fun. At least not for me.
As for the I-war part, that game was a ton of fun - until I learned just how much the dynamics can be (ab)used. If the AI would not have speed limits, and could use half-smart evasion routines, the player could practically never kill a ship. That's why I say it would be frustratring.
But this is not thread about I-war, nor is it about Newtonian dynamics. Apalogies again, if I was found offensive.
Me, as the founder of the "X3 into Space Simulator Modification" project, is highly offended indeed 
... of course no offense ... and I really see your point. I "messed" alot by changing for instance the max speed of ships just to discover the AI making reaaaaly weird things! When ships go more than 600-800 they are pratically unable to shoot a single shot and go on circle forever.
So I agree that AI is the nr.1 issue, even more for the realistic-space obsessed freak player like me ... indeed what's more unrealistic than a completely stupid pilot ... well... Teladi's apart thou 
P.S. Nevertherless you have to try the game if not yet, I'm sure you'll appreciate the way the NP ships behave... here the link:
http://ifh.firstones.com/ ... it's a free game
... of course no offense
... and I really see your point. I "messed" alot by changing for instance the max speed of ships just to discover the AI making reaaaaly weird things! When ships go more than 600-800 they are pratically unable to shoot a single shot and go on circle forever.So I agree that AI is the nr.1 issue, even more for the realistic-space obsessed freak player like me
... indeed what's more unrealistic than a completely stupid pilot ... well... Teladi's apart thou P.S. Nevertherless you have to try the game if not yet, I'm sure you'll appreciate the way the NP ships behave... here the link:
http://ifh.firstones.com/ ... it's a free game